Jump to content
Flying Purple Hippos Forums
Sign in to follow this  
Dave

political compass time

Recommended Posts

Tried to get Stalin, -9.0 economic, +7.54 authoritarian. I have no idea how to go further into that corner.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

don't worry, if current trends continue, veggie will be able to explain that to us within the next 10-15 years

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Shusky" and "Lief" needs to be "Tomasz" and "Cyrus" if we're going with real names. OR IS THIS A META JOKE ABOUT OUR INCONSISTENCY?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You did, sometime back in the mid-2000s, when you sent me an email with the wrong google account.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2004:

Economic Left/Right: -2.62
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.15

 

2007:
Economic Left/Right: -2.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.38

 

2008:

Economic Left/Right: -3.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.28

2014:
Economic Left/Right: -3.62
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.51

 

2015:

Economic Left/Right: -5.0

Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.21

 

I am moving ever so slightly to the left economically. But basically unchanged...

 

As does everyone else here! But what happened 5-6 years ago? People swang over to the right in college to become liberetrian and then went back to being liberal?

 

Also, hi!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whoa, it's been like 6 months since your last post.

 

My swing to the economic right in 2006-2007 was pre-college. I was taking college courses then, but I hadn't transferred to the university I graduated from and was still living at home, so I basically consider that high school 2.0. I remember DF and I being super capitalist ideologues just before college.

 

Personally, seeing what did and didn't work during the crash of 2008 helped pull me towards the center for pragmatic reasons. Also, I've become more concerned with climate change (helps to move away from an echo chamber of individuals denying it) and have actually taken economics courses which gave me a wider scope of understanding. A lot of these questions are geared towards "How much do you adore multinational corporations and believe they will do no wrong?". Now I clearly see the value of regulation to shape the market away from large abuses of the public interest, whereas before I was too focused on the negatives of regulation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, my move to the economic right was me becoming an idealistic libertarian. The move to the left doesn't reflect me losing those ideals, though. I still believe that ideally, doing most things on a monopolistic, national basis is morally inferior to letting people do it consensually, and I especially still believe that it's completely retarded that people can have fewer basic human rights because of the place they were born in. Borders are insane monstrosities. On the other hand, most of the economic left/right questions ask whether you're okay with what corporations are doing now, and that's a completely different question. Whatever the system we now is, it's not the free market ideal I believe in, and you have to be rather blind to think otherwise.

There's lots of statements that go "HUMANITY IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN CORPORATIONS LEL :mspa: " and previously I'd strongly disagree because it was a retarded dichotomy, corporations make profit for giving people stuff they want and are generally a good thing. Now I'd agree because in political practice, strong corporations have their fingers in way too many pies and are a larger threat to equality before the law than joe the hobo. Meanwhile, my ideals haven't changed fundamentally :/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also my move to ever-increasing social permissiveness is just me being less of a fucking hitler than you monsters

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

(and also most likely me living in the netherlands rather than in the usa and thus still being about the same amount from the political centre on average)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lief wandered around a bit but ended up in the right place. Dan is still on his way there, as is Shusky. Veggie I'm worried about.

 

Dave I'm worried about you, if you're that consistent you can't possibly be putting you own beliefs to the test regularly

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I regularly put my beliefs to the test and come to the same conclusions every time. My parents and pretty much everyone else around me has the same political beliefs as me (with perhaps the exception that I'm willing to entertain crazy ideas with some vague goal of somehow improving the future), university towns and such, so I came to these conclusions at a relatively early age. I'm also a few years older than most of you, when we started this I was almost entering college while you fuckers were teenagers. Finally I remember how I both interpreted and answered most of the questions last time around, and since most of them are stupidly written, the interpretation is important.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

8a81ce6277.png

 

dave = [-7.92 -4.91; -7.88 -4.72; -7.73 -4.51; -7.75 -4.36];
joost = [4.38 -4.05; 8.25 -5.90; 9.0 -6.41; 10 -5.22; 9.25 -7.79; 3.12 -7.49; 2.13 -7.74];
john = [1 1.79; 2.25 1.54; 9.75 -4.62; 9 -2.72; .38 -4.56; 1 -4.1];
shusky = [-2.12 -.87; 1.75 -2.1; 2.88 -3.18; -2.38 -6.97; -3.5 -6.62];
veggie = [-5 -5; -5.26 -4.43; -2.75 -4.29; -4 -3; -4.63 -1.85];
lief = [-4.62 -5.23; -8 -6.15; -5.75 -5.28; -6.63 -4.1; -6.75 -3.44; -6.12 -3.69; -7.63 -4.46];
dan = [3.75 1.79; -5.88 -7.64; -7 -6.05];
mike = [-2.62 -4.15; -2.13 -5.38; -3.75 -5.28; -3.62 -6.51; -5 -6.21];

nyears = 13;
mean = zeros(nyears,2);
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(dave)/2,dave(:,1),linspace(1,numel(dave)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(dave)/2,dave(:,2),linspace(1,numel(dave)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(joost)/2,joost(:,1),linspace(1,numel(joost)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(joost)/2,joost(:,2),linspace(1,numel(joost)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(john)/2,john(:,1),linspace(1,numel(john)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(john)/2,john(:,2),linspace(1,numel(john)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(shusky)/2,shusky(:,1),linspace(1,numel(shusky)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(shusky)/2,shusky(:,2),linspace(1,numel(shusky)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(veggie)/2,veggie(:,1),linspace(1,numel(veggie)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(veggie)/2,veggie(:,2),linspace(1,numel(veggie)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(lief)/2,lief(:,1),linspace(1,numel(lief)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(lief)/2,lief(:,2),linspace(1,numel(lief)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(dan)/2,dan(:,1),linspace(1,numel(dan)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(dan)/2,dan(:,2),linspace(1,numel(dan)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean + [interp1(1:numel(mike)/2,mike(:,1),linspace(1,numel(mike)/2,nyears))' interp1(1:numel(mike)/2,mike(:,2),linspace(1,numel(mike)/2,nyears))'];
mean = mean ./ 8;


figure(1); clf; 

plot(mean(:,1),mean(:,2),'ko-','LineWidth',2.5,'MarkerSize',12); hold on;
plot(dave(:,1),dave(:,2),'o-');
plot(joost(:,1),joost(:,2),'ro-');
plot(john(:,1),john(:,2),'go-');
plot(shusky(:,1),shusky(:,2),'mo-');
plot(veggie(:,1),veggie(:,2),'co-');
plot(lief(:,1),lief(:,2),'o-','color',[.7 .7 0]);
plot(dan(:,1),dan(:,2),'ko-');
plot(mike(:,1),mike(:,2),'o-','color',[0 .6 0]);

plot(mean(end,1),mean(end,2),'k.','MarkerSize',60);
plot(dave(end,1),dave(end,2),'.','MarkerSize',30);
plot(joost(end,1),joost(end,2),'r.','MarkerSize',30);
plot(john(end,1),john(end,2),'g.','MarkerSize',30);
plot(shusky(end,1),shusky(end,2),'m.','MarkerSize',30);
plot(veggie(end,1),veggie(end,2),'c.','MarkerSize',30);
plot(lief(end,1),lief(end,2),'.','MarkerSize',30,'color',[.7 .7 0]);
plot(dan(end,1),dan(end,2),'k.','MarkerSize',30);
plot(mike(end,1),mike(end,2),'.','MarkerSize',30,'color',[0 .6 0]);

plot([-10 10],[0 0],'k--'); plot([0 0],[-10 10],'k--');
legend('Mean','Dave','Joost','John','Shusky','Sun Ha','Lief','Dan','Mike','location','North');
axis([-10 10 -10 10]); axis square;
xlabel('Economic left/right');
ylabel('Social liberal/conservative');
title('The Exciting Evolution of FPH''s Political Beliefs, 2003-2015');
  • I'm with stupid 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I regularly put my beliefs to the test and come to the same conclusions every time. My parents and pretty much everyone else around me has the same political beliefs as me (with perhaps the exception that I'm willing to entertain crazy ideas with some vague goal of somehow improving the future), university towns and such, so I came to these conclusions at a relatively early age. I'm also a few years older than most of you, when we started this I was almost entering college while you fuckers were teenagers. Finally I remember how I both interpreted and answered most of the questions last time around, and since most of them are stupidly written, the interpretation is important.

Question: what beliefs are these? (People around you, that you grew up with, not yours). Do you guys believe in a larger government that provides more care for the poor?

 

It's so odd to me how very much divided wealthier Americans are. Like 3 hours from you is the world's capital of greed, but pretty much every state around it is left leaning :|.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

College towns are basically grown up hippies. Not necessarily much larger government than we have right now (as we feel that much of the budget is poorly spent), but definitely providing more services, and taxes set at wherever they need to be to pay for that.

 

NYC is pretty left/liberal as well, btw. There just happens to be some banking shit that goes on there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not entirely sure that's something to be quite happy with, though. You're basically admitting that you're in a left-liberal echo chamber, and as much as I find the ideas behind them sympathetic, any echo chamber is death for critical thought.

 

I remember my older interpretation of many questions as well, and nowadays that's not the interpretation I go with. To put it differently, I interpret my own ideals differently. Perhaps most weirdly, without changing my ideas of what a just society is, I'd identify my ideas as left-wing now, when I'd identify them as right-wing a decade ago. That's not that weird - the right wing in the Netherlands used to be rather openly liberal (socially, and in their interpretation of what just economic policy is), and now they're basically downright conservative (again, socially and in their justification for economic-right policy, e.g. they used to argue for a smaller social security network and tighter immigration laws because they couldn't justify the associated costs and taxation consequences, and now they argue the same because people on benefits are lazy and all immigrants are scary muslims. Big difference.) I don't want to associate with that, and I can't have a discussion with them in the same way I used to, because the common moral ground has disappeared. The only framework for me to express the same liberal ("libertarian") ideas in is now through social-liberal centrist ideals or even through labour-movement terminology. For some questions that doesn't make a difference ("from each according to their ability to each according to their need" is still shit because who the fuck is to justly decide for everyone who needs what, and because doing more for the community with your ability should be rewarded over not doing anything with it), while for others I switch completely ("what is good for big corporations is good for all of us" is true as a dogma of the free market - you make profit if you give people shit they want - but not true from the viewpoint of social critique which is how I have to express myself now).

 

Anyway, if you don't feel the need to interpret questions differently at all, you've either not put your ideas to the test, or you haven't expressed them in a different context or environment, or both. In either case you're probably in trouble. Changing your mind is a good way to make sure you still have one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not entirely sure that's something to be quite happy with, though. You're basically admitting that you're in a left-liberal echo chamber, and as much as I find the ideas behind them sympathetic, any echo chamber is death for critical thought..

Haven't read the rest of your post yet but I don't think he's arguing he's proud of it. He is just explaining why, proud or not, he's been with the same view since he was 17.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To be clear I meant that after significant examination of other ideas, self reflection, etc. I have come to the positions I currently hold, and it was merely convenient that I started in the same place.

 

Also, when I was younger (maybe 14-15, when you guys started recording your answers to this) I was significantly further to the right economically, although about the same socially or maybe a bit more liberal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My last answer near +9 economically was when I was 21 though, and I still completely understand how and why I'd fill in my answers that way. It's not all just teenage naïveté.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To be clear I meant that after significant examination of other ideas, self reflection, etc. I have come to the positions I currently hold, and it was merely convenient that I started in the same place.

NINJA'D!

 

You'll be enormously surprised given even a small exposure to a different society/culture/system how much your view can expand/change. Reason why the US political system can be so extremely shitty to so many is that we're all relatively comfortable despite it all. We can afford inefficient programs for a long time without jeopardizing the safety of our private investments. We can afford to let people get desperate/poor enough because we've convinced them that "nation" means a military and everything else is none of the nations' business.

 

Go to a country (like Brazil) where every bit of spending counts. Where there's very few things to safely invest in already and then have those be taxed enormously in inefficient government programs essentially taking your money and investing it very poorly. Even if the program does work, and even if the corrupt didn't take a large amount of your money, you'll have a lot less control over your family's own financial safety.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm kinda curious what the average overall was and how it's changed over the past decade, and whether the average change in our group turns out, for all our personal explanations, to be just a feature of societal change~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Elpea go gather your own results so that I won't be so alone in the Awesome Quarter (© DF, 2003)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...